*1312: The F Word* Post-Air Discussion

Discuss new episodes without ruining them for people in other time zones.

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Re: *1312: The F Word* Post-Air Discussion

Postby bigbadwolff » Wed Nov 04, 2009 11:10 pm

I have never been able to understand why some people take South Park episodes so serious and immediately get pissed off because they continue to go for the WOW factor. The offensive nature of the shows is partly why a lot of people probably watch week after week.

It clearly states at the beginning of each episode that the show is intended for "mature audiences only" so if you are going to cry like little bitches because they make fun of bikers or use the word "homosexual" then quit watching.

One of the great things about South Park is that they don't single anybody out. They put everybody on blast. Quit being so sensitive and get a sense of humor!!
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Re: *1312: The F Word* Post-Air Discussion

Postby Aleicia » Wed Nov 04, 2009 11:14 pm

ssouthparkk4602 wrote:Hurry before link gets deleted!

You are a God. :D
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Re: *1312: The F Word* Post-Air Discussion

Postby NixonMcCormic » Wed Nov 04, 2009 11:23 pm

gudlyf wrote:The alien in this week's South Park: http://clak.us/traj

Thanks dude, I kept looking on my tv and couldn't find that alien. Dang tv, it cuts off part of the sides of the show for some reason. I need a new tv. Lol, only one i couldn't find.
Me: I'm sorry I have to do this Stan, but as long as you are in the picture, I can't have Wendy.

Stan: No, no you can't do this do me!

Me: Goodbye Stan. *closes package* Have fun in Scottsdale.
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Re: *1312: The F Word* Post-Air Discussion

Postby troyhicks » Wed Nov 04, 2009 11:42 pm

Ha I had no idea that homosexual had so many meanings. So inconsiderate assh*le and homosexual are synonyms!!!
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Re: *1312: The F Word* Post-Air Discussion

Postby kengc » Wed Nov 04, 2009 11:44 pm

hahaha awesome harley davidson riders really totally f*cking homosexuals!
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Re: *1312: The F Word* Post-Air Discussion

Postby KSBkr » Wed Nov 04, 2009 11:50 pm

LOUD PIPES SAVE LIVES. During this time of year, bikes with loud pipes help thwart deer from running in fromt of them. Loud pipes also make you idiot cage drivers who text or put on your make up while driving notice us and keep us alive. I have watched SP since the very first episode and have NEVER been offended. Today, I came really close. Partly because the leader of the bike group looked very familar to an important person in the non-1% biker world.
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Re: *1312: The F Word* Post-Air Discussion

Postby Pegazeus » Wed Nov 04, 2009 11:51 pm

Twas a good episode. Had it's moments, but not nearly as good as last weeks. I feel like there were 2 jokes stretched out for a whole episode.

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Re: *1312: The F Word* Post-Air Discussion

Postby somerandomguy » Wed Nov 04, 2009 11:57 pm

jwin1 wrote:The worst episode ever. The episode wasn't even funny.

I truly believe in free speech, relish this American freedom, and believe South Park has every right to be offensive or say anything whenever desired. However, a few references here and there to "that's gay" or other such hate-speech (week after week and year after year) is a FAR cry from an entire episode devoted to the word "homosexual".

South Park would be off the air in seconds if there had been an entire episode using 'n*gger' or 'spic' or 'kike', but you feel it's OK to hit the airwaves with 'homosexual'. It's more than offensive, it's disgusting. Trying to excuse homophobia by claiming there are variations of word usage/meaning is unacceptable.

I've been a big fan since the show's inception but I am angry and unwilling to be tolerant of blatant on-air hate speech. I think South Park's creators, writers, and producers owe the GLBT community a huge apology.

I'm so confused... On one hand this is the first episode I can say I truly didn't laugh while watching.. once.. but on the other hand I feel like I need to defend it from retards like the poster I quoted above. How someone with any semblance of a working brain cell could watch the entire episode (or even just parts of it) and come away with the idea that they were being in ANY way homophobic, truly astounds me. Good lord man, they even had homosexuals in the episode taking offense until they understood what was going on. How did you not relate to that??? And don't for a second say that an episode dedicated to "ni**ers" is an ANY way the same as "f*gs". Like they pointed out in the episode, "f*gs" has been used to label people for HUNDREDS of years (and for what it counts, the majority of the time it hasn't had anything to do with homosexuals. Relatively speaking, that's a new term). No one gets cut off by a random guy and says: "ni**er" or "k*ke" or any of the other examples you listed, "f*g" on the other hand IS used, so don't pretend like it's the same thing. The funniest part is that homosexuals and a small handful of ignoramuses are the only ones making sure homosexuals and "f*g" are still related with each other. If they would just stop going out of their way to take offense every time someone says "f*g", it would only be a few years before people started to forgetting that's what it used to mean. If you hate the word so much, STOP CLAIMING IT!! People are asking for it to mean something else and you're complaining about that??? I'm actually starting to think you LIKE that it's still your word and you'd miss it if it was gone... Hypocrite.
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Re: *1312: The F Word* Post-Air Discussion

Postby kengc » Wed Nov 04, 2009 11:58 pm

Serioulsy a fantastic episode. laughed all the way thru, thanks Matt n' Trey!
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Re: *1312: The F Word* Post-Air Discussion

Postby petafile » Thu Nov 05, 2009 12:27 am

One of the best episodes in a long time. I lived in Golden for a while, and f@gs on Harleys completely ruin the town. It scares me how clear a bunch of kids can make complicated issues on a regular basis.

SP fan for life
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Re: *1312: The F Word* Post-Air Discussion

Postby Dennin » Thu Nov 05, 2009 12:39 am

Quite certainly, almost possibly, the best episode I've seen yet... I think.
Oh wait. There was that one from season 3... Oh, and the one where Cartman ragged on Kyle... oh and I almost forgot that one where Kenny died...
Yup, almost certainly the best episode to date... probably... I guess. :timmy:
People are like slinky's, pretty much useless, but they make me smile when I push 'em down the stairs.
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Multiple Aliens???

Postby Beeb » Thu Nov 05, 2009 12:54 am

Could they have put in two? One for the TV viewers too? In the Library, on left side, in background, head moving, when they first cut to bikers and lead Biker says, "F@gg0t...", that sure looks like one. My slow motion is too shakey to get a good view (yes, VCR). Brown-stone one is cut-off by TV format, for sure. The way folks answer (if you believe DIVER is DINER) verses LIBRARY would be a dead giveaway as to what format one is viewing.
EDIT: (( haha, they switch F_word for Homo6ual == fag homosexual homosexual fags faguals ))
Last edited by Beeb on Thu Nov 05, 2009 1:00 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: *1312: The F Word* Post-Air Discussion

Postby jjwinter » Thu Nov 05, 2009 12:56 am

One of the best episodes of this season! I loved it!

This is why context and intentions matter in speech, not word choice.
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Re: *1312: The F Word* Post-Air Discussion

Postby urbear1987 » Thu Nov 05, 2009 1:03 am

First off I am gay.

I want to address the episode. I understand it's intentions and I know they weren't attempting to assail homosexuals. That being said.

I disagree with the point they were trying to make and many people on this forum are trying to make. Number 1: homosexuals did NOT take the terms "gay" and "F4G" and use them for ourselves. Those were terms that were attached to us by other groups:

The word "Homosexual" was invented in the late 19th century in order to describe a "disease" or "disorder".

Today, we hear "homosexual" and barely bat an eyelash at the thought. However, to a Victorian-era individual, "homosexual" was a term that was synonymous with medical abnormality, akin to a lethal disease. To this end, euphemisms and other creative ways of referring to this [same-sex attraction] were created - one well-known expression was "the love which dare not speak its name" -- people HAD to have a term to refer to this concept of same-sex love, and "homosexual" was considered a term reserved for serious medical discourse. Some observations were formed about the character of homosexuals - that they were carefree with their sexuality, and they deviated from conventional norms - and thus the term "gay" was applied to them. In fact, "gay" began as a term referring to any non-conservative sexuality.

At this point, we should perhaps clarify the distinction between "accepting" a label and "picking" a label. Minorities are notorious for having little to no say in what labels are put upon them, and I highly doubt that homosexuals at the time willingly petitioned to be called "gay". HOWEVER, considering the options available at the time - "homosexual" still being the medical disease word - there's not much of a choice, and at least "gay" implies a degree of "happiness".

SO, in a nutshell:

I suppose the bigger question to the nay-sayers is "Well, if not 'gay', what should same-sex relationships have been called, excluding 'homosexual'?"

F4G the word has been used since the late sixteenth century to mean "old or unpleasant woman". ibid. Female terms are often used with reference to homosexual or effeminate men (cf. nancy, sissy, queen) and this seems the most likely derivation. It is also possible that the meaning derives from the use of the word as a derogatory term for street prostitutes, female and male, because of their association with the gutter, where "faggot-ends" of meat were thrown by butchers. The term "homosexual girls" for prostitutes is attested from the late 19th century.

The problem today being that because these terms were attached to homosexuals they accepted them as identifiers and attempted to reduce the hurtfulness of the words by making them positive indicators. This is similar to the use of terms like "Brother" and "Nigga" by African Americans today in an attempt to reduce the hate in those words or similar words.

The problem that stems from that is that because those words are still recognized as identifiers by a large part of the population, they still carry a hidden connotation regardless of the intent of the speaker. Someone who says "That's gay." can very easily only be meaning "That's stupid." but to anyone who has the connotation of "gay=homosexual" the connotation reads "gay=stupid thus homosexual=stupid". Even without the speaker's intent the word and usage is seen as implying negative connotations with homosexuality.

Additionally the terms "F4G" and "gay" would never have gained their negative connotations in this time period if it hadn't been for their connection to the homosexual community and the general hate and misconception directed towards gays in the earlier, and current, parts of the 21st and 22nd century. The terms had been "dead terms" that had fallen out of use in conventional english until they were revived with their homosexual attachment.

Regardless of if you agree or not, the question is, why are "gay" and "F4G" acceptable go to insults when things like "N*gger" and other racially charged epitaphs are not? Why is it that you can't use other terms that have inherently bad connotations (stupid meaning lacking intelligence is a good example) when you intend to insult someone or something?

The fact of the matter is that if you didn't want to offend someone you COULD choose to use other words, the fact that you don't and that you take offense to being asked to use other language or that you take offense to people being offended by those terms doesn't speak to the idea that you're beliefs are correct or acceptable, only to the fact that you don't have enough respect for the groups you're offending to be considerate of their feelings. In the end it makes you look inconsiderate at best.
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Re: *1312: The F Word* Post-Air Discussion

Postby Big-Will » Thu Nov 05, 2009 1:19 am

With homosexuality becoming quite acceptable, there's not much reason left to call gay people phags, so Matt and Trey propose that obnoxious bikers be called phags. I understand there are still gay folk who take offense at the work "phag" and find it offensive that anyone else is called a phag who isn't gay.
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