Chanukah

A General discussion about everything other than South Park

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zzyzx
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Re: Chanukah

Postby zzyzx » Mon Dec 29, 2008 7:19 pm

Frosty_D wrote:They probally will not respond.
<offtopic>
uh.... I'm probally going to use your picture in the sig as a reference</offtopic>


^ * this just in * Hallmark Greeting Card Company DID respond, just moments ago! They are helping me do some research. The following link was sent to me from Hallmark itself:

(It doesn't mention greeting cards, but it's a start. I'm sure those working today at Hallmark were not there in the 1950's as the change started to transform; nevertheless, what Hallmark emailed me is a good start. Enjoy!

Here is the link Hallmark sent me
Last edited by zzyzx on Mon Dec 29, 2008 8:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Frosty_D
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Re: Chanukah

Postby Frosty_D » Mon Dec 29, 2008 7:25 pm

Didn't think they would. I have to ask you something.... what is so important of the "ch" sound?
zzyzx
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Re: Chanukah

Postby zzyzx » Mon Dec 29, 2008 7:29 pm

^ Because Chanukah is spelled in Hebrew with the letter "chet." It is not spelled with the Hebrew letter: "Hay."

Forgive me to repeat some of a post I previously posted, but maybe this might clarify it a little more:

In Hebrew, Chanukah is spelled like this:

חנוכה

Hebrew is read from right to left, unlike English which is read from left to right. The first letter, "chet" is this letter:
"ח"

The Hebrew letter "Hay" looks like this:
ה
The "Hay" is pronounced as an "H"; it is also sometimes a silent letter, i.e., it appears in the writing of the word, but it is not pronounced.

But the "Chet" has no equivalent in English. It is more like a gargling sound, as Big-Will suggested earlier: similar to the "ch" in the Scottish word: "loch."

Because there is no similar sound in English, many spellings have come up. Chanukah, pronouncing the "Ch" as the gargling sound (not "ch" as in "chocolate.")

So, the word in the original Hebrew starts with the letter "chet" which unfortunately there is no such sound in English. And that is why I find the "Ch" to be important, as the word is spelled with the letter "chet" which unfortunately has no English equivalent. Using an "H" IMO is just wrong, as it is NOT "H" in the Hebrew, it is the "Chet."
Kelly MacCornmac
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Re: Chanukah

Postby Kelly MacCornmac » Mon Dec 29, 2008 7:34 pm

I know that, but what I mean is why is it so important to you personally. I mean there is bound be a lot of error in many things, why does a simple mispronunciation bother you? The info is nice, but that doesn't really help much...
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Big-Will
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Re: Chanukah

Postby Big-Will » Mon Dec 29, 2008 7:39 pm

Latin doesn't have the ch sound Chanukah has. Greek has it with Χ, which becomes Ch in Latin and has the K sound, which is why Christ is "Krist" and not "Hrist." Heck, Latin doesn't have the H sound either - the h found in words coming from Greek, like historia and in Latin, like hora, are either silent or have gone missing - Latin homo becomes Italian uomo, for example. Had the Romance languages taken it from Latin, it would have been Cánuca in Spanish.
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zzyzx
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Re: Chanukah

Postby zzyzx » Mon Dec 29, 2008 7:41 pm

Kelly MacCornmac wrote:I know that, but what I mean is why is it so important to you personally. I mean there is bound be a lot of error in many things, why does a simple mispronunciation bother you? The info is nice, but that doesn't really help much...


Well, when I learned English, and when I learned Hebrew, I was taught (as everyone is taught) how to pronounce certain letters and words. And if the word is mispronounced, I just cringe. I guess a better explanation as to why I cringe is in the field of music:

I play the piano. If I hit a wrong note, I cringe. I spot it right away. If I play the piece over again without hitting the wrong note, there is a sense of satisfaction and accomplishment.

Same in speaking any language. When Chanukah is mispronounced, I cringe. That's all. Because Chanukah starts with the letter "chet," then I cringe if the "chet" is pronounced as an "H."

An English example is the word: buffet. It is pronounced: bu-fay. I cringe when people pronounce it: búf-fet. And people do pronounce "buffet" as "búf-fet." And that is why I want to tell people about the hebrew letter "chet."

Big-Will wrote:Latin doesn't have the ch sound Chanukah has. Greek has it with Χ, which becomes Ch in Latin and has the K sound, which is why Christ is "Krist" and not "Hrist." Heck, Latin doesn't have the H sound either - the h found in words coming from Greek, like historia and in Latin, like hora, are either silent or have gone missing - Latin homo becomes Italian uomo, for example. Had the Romance languages taken it from Latin, it would have been Cánuca in Spanish.


That very interesting, Will. Interesting because when the Bible was first translated from the Hebrew and Aramaic to the common language of the people of the time (the Greek language), it was translated into the Greek and called the Septuagint, Latin for "Seventy" as 72 elders, 6 from each one of the 12 tribes of Israel, translated the Hebrew/Aramaic for those living in Alexandria. And the "X" of the Greek was similar to the "chet" in the Hebrew.
zzyzx
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Re: Chanukah

Postby zzyzx » Sun Jan 11, 2009 9:58 pm

There are now 335 days left until Chanukah (Dec. 11, 2009).
zzyzx
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Re: Chanukah

Postby zzyzx » Sat Jan 17, 2009 5:51 pm

:|
Last edited by zzyzx on Mon Jan 19, 2009 8:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Kelly MacCornmac
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Re: Chanukah

Postby Kelly MacCornmac » Sat Jan 17, 2009 6:37 pm

No offense Z, but you should just let this thread die out until next Chanukah. You can always make up a thread next year about it, for Chanukah is gone and over with for now.
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zzyzx
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Re: Chanukah

Postby zzyzx » Sat Jan 17, 2009 8:37 pm

:|
Last edited by zzyzx on Mon Jan 19, 2009 8:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Frosty_D
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Re: Chanukah

Postby Frosty_D » Sat Jan 17, 2009 8:54 pm

zzyzx wrote:I was letting this thread "die out" until JP said in a different thread today (something about to say something of the previous poster, or the previous poster's avatar, or something) - JP said that "he celebrates Chanukah."

Therefore, I posted today how many days are left until Chanukah.

...that's not really a good reason to bump this thread

btw, we think about Chanukah every day, not just during Chanukah. It's not like the 4th of July or Halloween that is celebrated for one day. It is celebrated for 8 days, and during the rest of the year during daily prayers, there is a section of what to read/pray during Chanukah, and a section of what to read/pray when it is NOT Chanukah. I won't get into details, but Jews think about Chanukah every day, unlike other holidays that come around once a year.


Just because holidays are shorter that doesn't mean that other people don't think about it too Z.

Last week, I posted the number of days until the next Chanukah. That was it for me for a few months, when I would post an update again. But because Chanukah was discussed today, as in: "He celebrates Chanukah" I updated the number of days left today.

...what :| why? It's kinda annoying and pointless..no offence, but it is[/quote]


That being said, I will try not to post here so soon, but I will periodically update this thread.
I'm sorry, but it really urks me that you are going to bump this thread just to try to get more readers :/

Kelly MacCornmac wrote:No offense Z, but you should just let this thread die out until next Chanukah. You can always make up a thread next year about it, for Chanukah is gone and over with for now.


No, the statement: ". . . for Chanukah is gone and over with for now." is incorrect. The celebration is over for the next 329 days, but we think of it and say certain prayers NOW and everyday, three times a day. And the lessons of Chanukah is incorporated in our daily lives throughout the year.
.... yes but, same with Christmas, but you don't see that thread being bumped, no?


Don't let Chanukah bother you. But I will not, as you suggested, "just let this thread die out until next Chanukah." We think of Chanukah daily, not just during the eight days.
I'm not letting it bug me, it's the bumping that is bugging me.
zzyzx
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Re: Chanukah

Postby zzyzx » Sat Jan 17, 2009 9:43 pm

:|
Last edited by zzyzx on Mon Jan 19, 2009 8:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
RideTheLightning
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Re: Chanukah

Postby RideTheLightning » Sat Jan 17, 2009 9:46 pm

zzyzx wrote:
Kelly MacCornmac wrote:No offense, Z


That's zzyzx, (all lower case), NOT uppercase "Z"

It's spelled: z-z-y-z-x, not spelled: "Z"

You want to decree if my posts have any value (if they don't have any value in your opinion than you say I'm bumping the post). I don't accept the rule that you made up that posts have to go through your own filter; if you like them, fine, if you don't like them, my posts have no value. WRONG. We are to have a free exchange of ideas, not you saying my posts have no value.

And the username I chose for myself is zzyzx, not Z. Now you want to change my username too. DON'T.


...Are you trolling?
zzyzx
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Re: Chanukah

Postby zzyzx » Sat Jan 17, 2009 9:50 pm

:|
Last edited by zzyzx on Mon Jan 19, 2009 8:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Frosty_D
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Re: Chanukah

Postby Frosty_D » Sat Jan 17, 2009 9:55 pm

zzyzx wrote:That's zzyzx, (all lower case), NOT uppercase "Z"

It's spelled: z-z-y-z-x, not spelled: "Z"

And the username I chose for myself is zzyzx, not Z. Now you want to change my username too. DON'T.

WTF? I wasn't trying to change your username... I can't spell your username, so I abriviate it as Z. I have before but you didn't say anything about it.

EDIT: He was referring to you, Z, me thinks.

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