RELIGION - what? LET'S UNITE AGAINST SOCIAL CONSERVATIVES!

A General discussion about everything other than South Park

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Wii fit man
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Re: RELIGION THREAD

Postby Wii fit man » Sun Jan 25, 2009 7:02 pm

Your Shadow wrote:
Kelly MacCornmac wrote:
Michaeloptv wrote:I'll admit it. The bible does have flaws.

God could not create earth in 7 days....it is an elliptical period (why they did they do this-ask King James :lol: )

Another one WAS Noah's ark...in which he didn't find one of EVERY animal...it was just 2 of many.... :P
Then how do you know if god exists then?

Kmac: you wonder why I am always against change...change is not always good!
I didn't say it was, did I? Keeping traditions isn't always the best either sometimes.

I don't think Barack Obama is best for our country.
To be honest here, I don't really care for politics.


Oh and god turned his back on satan. I am not sure how you got that one mixed up. Satan was from the beginning always the evil one.
So god made him evil?

The story of Adam and Eve proves it. :P

How so? I thought that it was a snake, not Satan.

*and not to get you really mad Kmac...but I don't really like philoposphy

To me they dig around too much.... :roll:

What do you mean, dig around too much?

Sometimes it is best to leave what is untouched, untouched-so that we can still believe in something.*

Uh..... religion has been a touchy subject. And it has been touched before, at least once.


Kelly,

I find you stubborn, mean, selfish internet-addicted psychopath.
What you are typing and doing lately is really getting on my nerves.

So just really keep the idiotic and stupid remarks to yourself from now on. Also I find you a hipocrit. Double posting when you enforce it on everybody else.

What the hell? I think you're all those things. I'm glad Kmac isn't on line right now.
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triplemultiplex
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Re: RELIGION THREAD

Postby triplemultiplex » Sun Jan 25, 2009 7:34 pm

M00ndragon69 wrote:And now we come to what I wanted to say to TripleMutliplex's arrogant ass. <snipped for space>


Damn, I was worried you might take some of what I said personally.
The intellectual laziness I discussed is referring only to the issues of the supernatural. I'm not suggesting that beliefs in that stuff means a person is intellectually lazy about everything, just about one or two things.

I don't at all pretend that I know all the answers to the great existential questions, what I do know is that no one else does either. The ultimate arrogance is a person saying that they're religion is the correct one; that some all powerful deity exists and only they know what it wants people to do. It can be difficult to say some of this stuff without sounding like a jerk, but the truth always hurts someone. This is why I avoid using the pronoun "you" when discussing a religion.

M00ndragon69 wrote:You say that "superstitious" people are holding back the advancement of society, well what are you personally doing to better society?


I'm a voice for rationality and reason in a society that's full of irrationality, fraud and false hope. I'm one less sucker in the world.
And my lifestyle in the city uses much less energy than the typical individual in this country. I'm within walking distance of almost everything, including my office. Drop in the bucket, I know, but it makes sense to me.

M00ndragon69 wrote:And do you lump every other form of religion in with Christianity?


Yeah, pretty much. Because when one takes a step back and looks at all these religions from an outsider's perspective, the ridiculousness of them all becomes apparent. Any current religion is about as plausible as Greek mythology or some other dead religion modern humans dismiss.

I would dispute your claim that I have a problem with people who think differently than I do about a subject. If someone elects to post their opinion about something and I have a differing opinion, I post to provide a counter-point. These topics on SPS are never personal for me. I can honestly say I do not consider myself superior to someone I disagree with.

That said, I'll admit, I've said some jerk stuff before and probably will again at some point. It's just part of who I am. I think everyone has a little jerk in them, it's just a question of what will bring out that jerk.
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Re: RELIGION THREAD

Postby Wii fit man » Sun Jan 25, 2009 7:59 pm

That's a lot like what I wanted to say. By the way, good post, Miracle123. It's nice to see someone who doesn't like insulting other's religons. If you want to call me a hypocrit for saying that, f*ck off. You don't need to find everything wrong with people's statements. The only religous people that bug me are the ones who get mad at me for being an atheist or try to convert me. You know what's funny? When I put Christianity in my posts, my computer says it's not a word, but atheism is. :lol:
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miracle123
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Re: RELIGION THREAD

Postby miracle123 » Sun Jan 25, 2009 8:11 pm

Wii fit man wrote:By the way, good post, Miracle123. It's nice to see someone who doesn't like insulting other's religons.

heh thanks, It's good to know that at least someone bothered to read my post :)

Wii fit man wrote:The only religous people that bug me are the ones who get mad at me for being an atheist or try to convert me.

Yes, it is extremely annoying when religious douches try to convert you or some crap like that. I had to put up with a lot of that where I live, people trying to get me to believe in jesus and stuff.

Of course, it is just as annoying when this happens to me with athiests too. I've had several encounters with athiests when at the very moment I mentioned that I believed in god they gave me this look of disdain that pissed me off just as much as the religious douches.

This of course doesn't mean that all religious people or all athiests are like that, but it happens and one has to make sure not to become that kind of people when having these kind of conversations.
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Kelly MacCornmac
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Re: RELIGION THREAD

Postby Kelly MacCornmac » Sun Jan 25, 2009 9:27 pm

Moon, your right. I shouldn't have attacked them. I wasn't really thinking about other religions that were attacked when I posted that.

I've been thinking during work.... why does it matter if one person is right about religion or not? I mean, we disagree on others believes, but why?

Is it because people think that they know better? So when they die, they gloat?

Wii fit guy wrote:What the hell? I think you're all those things. I'm glad Kmac isn't on line right now.

Actually, I saw the post earlier on. I didn't have the time to do anything though.

Your Shadow wrote:
Kelly,

I find you stubborn, mean, selfish internet-addicted psychopath.
What you are typing and doing lately is really getting on my nerves.

So just really keep the idiotic and stupid remarks to yourself from now on.
Also I find you a hipocrit. Double posting when you enforce it on everybody else.

:|
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miracle123
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Re: RELIGION THREAD

Postby miracle123 » Sun Jan 25, 2009 10:49 pm

Kelly MacCornmac wrote:why does it matter if one person is right about religion or not? I mean, we disagree on others believes, but why?

Is it because people think that they know better? So when they die, they gloat?

I don't think we should underestimate the importance of being right, not to gloat but simply because it brings us closer to the truth.

Of course, excluding some particularly ridiculous beliefs, we can't possibly claim to be any closer to finding the truth than anyone else (at least not without sounding like arrogant pricks).

I personally prefer not underestimating anyone's beliefs, since I believe that with our exceptionally small knowledge of all these matters no one can really prove or counter any belief with absolute certainty (once again, not without being arrogant pricks). I simply believe what to me sounds like the more logical answer, but I'll never claim to be 100% right.
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Re: RELIGION THREAD

Postby superiorsavior » Mon Jan 26, 2009 12:16 am

Women were forced to only bear children and stay inside the house

A very Biblical view, though like most things I'm sure there's scripture that could be used on both sides of this :p

who in your life pissed you off about religion to the point where you feel the need to go off on strangers on a message board

No event (certainly not any person) 'pissed me off' with religion. Dogmatic and dualistic belief systems are absurd, and cause far more problems than they solve..

do you lump every other form of religion in with Christianity?

Every religion has the same level of evidence for it; the same miracles, the same testimonials, etc. They're already in the same sinking boat of credibility, I didn't lump them in there together.

Satan was from the beginning always the evil one.

If Satan exists, god created him, knowing all the sins he'd do, so god is ultimately responsible for all Satan does, Satan is like an arm of god's body. However, that aside, in the oldest forms of the abrahmic branch of religion, there was no Satan. Then he became that angel you see in Job, working for god. Then they decided he rebelled and was cast down. The snake was originally just an anthropomorphic snake.

I'll admit it. The bible does have flaw

How do you know where the flaws end and the truth begins in Christianity's only source of evidence, a source that all the major religions and a lot of the less major ones have their own competing version of it must be noted.

Religious people use a lot of evidence (faith for example) that could easily equally be used by the irriligious; such evidence should be inadmisable.

God is not a childish and naive illusion to people who are religious

That's what makes god a dangerous idea. Well not god, but the baggage that goes with it, such as the unquestioning dogmatic mindset of almost all religions.

We have had years of religious debate, and much of the time that is all people on here talk about.

As I say to people who don't like south park. If it isn't your thing, don't come here. No one's forcing you into religious debate. You could choose not to come to this topic. You come here. Just leave every religious thread alone if they bore/offend you.

excluding some particularly ridiculous beliefs, we can't possibly claim to be any closer to finding the truth than anyone else

Ockham's razor. The principle of parsimony. Religions make many, many claims, other than merely that 'there is a personal creator.' Each of these claims needs evidencing indipendantly. For example, an afterlife could be true without theism, and theism could be true without an afterlife, but a religion like chrtistianity requires both to be true. Religions presupose far too much based on far too little evidence (evidence every other competing religion shares) to be anything less than absurd. Belief in god alone is meaningless without the baggage that religion gives it.

it does not give people the right to go around and change things that have been said for generations

In god we trust was added in the 1950s as a response to the communist scare. I don't pretend to know much about them but from what i've heard the founding fathers were mostly irreligious Deists. Like Miraicle said, it doesn't matter what they believed anyway, this is 200 years later, things change, and that's a good thing in this case. Plus, the founding father's weren't the gods people worship them as, they made mistakes, such as many being slave owners.

that was really unnessacary

I have to agree. Let's keep this about IDEAS rather than about PEOPLE.
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Re: RELIGION THREAD

Postby RideTheLightning » Mon Jan 26, 2009 1:42 am

Y'know, this whole, "The Bible does have flaws", "Yea, well where do they begin and where do they end?" thing would be answered if someone read my last post :|
Last edited by RideTheLightning on Mon Jan 26, 2009 1:46 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: RELIGION THREAD

Postby Wii fit man » Mon Jan 26, 2009 1:43 am

Ready? If they prepared your post? :lol:
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miracle123
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Re: RELIGION THREAD

Postby miracle123 » Mon Jan 26, 2009 1:49 am

superiorsavior wrote:
God is not a childish and naive illusion to people who are religious

That's what makes god a dangerous idea. Well not god, but the baggage that goes with it, such as the unquestioning dogmatic mindset of almost all religions.

I dont exactly get what you mean by dangerous, but I agree in the importance of questioning the religious beliefs that you have been brought up with, or even lack of them, to make a full concious decision of what you choose to believe, even something so basic as god to religious people. Nothing on these matters should be taken for granted.

superiorsavior wrote:
excluding some particularly ridiculous beliefs, we can't possibly claim to be any closer to finding the truth than anyone else

Ockham's razor. The principle of parsimony.

Ockham what? The principle of what? What the hell are you talking about??

superiorsavior wrote:Religions make many, many claims, other than merely that 'there is a personal creator.' Each of these claims needs evidencing indipendantly.

That's very true, religious leaders many times tend to do that, which is very wrong in my opinion. I don't believe that any human is granted that ammount of knowledge to assure those matters, no matter how important anyone might believe this person is.

superiorsavior wrote:
that was really unnessacary

I have to agree. Let's keep this about IDEAS rather than about PEOPLE.

Who are you quoting dude??
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Re: RELIGION THREAD

Postby Wii fit man » Mon Jan 26, 2009 1:51 am

He's quoting me, the guy who read your posts. :(
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RideTheLightning
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Re: RELIGION THREAD

Postby RideTheLightning » Mon Jan 26, 2009 1:52 am

Wii fit man wrote:Ready? If they prepared your post? :lol:


Whaddya talkin' about? I wrote read, see? (Gotta love the edit button)


Here's part of what I wrote last time. Most of the stories in The Bible aren't supposed to be real. The stories in the BIble are...well...stories. Most never happened. They just teach you morals like work hard, do what's right, help others. The point of the Bible is to create a "heaven on Earth" if you will. You can do that by following the Bible. Though you don't HAVE to, if you are a Muslim, use the Coran, if you're an Atheist, do what you are now taught by others. Now the thing is, no matter who told you to do this because it's good, was taught by another, who was taught by another, who was taught by another, until it goes back to people who learned it from The BIble.
(And no, I'm not trying to convert anyone by saying thank The Bible for EVERYTHING good that has happened to you...even though you should :lol: )

But yea, my full post is a page back.

And Miracle, I think he means they are dangerous because they create wars. (Which is a failure to realize war is natural and would be fought about territories and political disagreements if religion was abandoned)
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Re: RELIGION THREAD

Postby miracle123 » Mon Jan 26, 2009 1:53 am

RideTheLightning wrote:Y'know, this whole, "The Bible does have flaws", "Yea, well where do they begin and where do they end?" thing would be answered if someone read my last post :|

I answered in the previous page to a bit of that as a matter of fact, last post in the page.
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Re: RELIGION THREAD

Postby Wii fit man » Mon Jan 26, 2009 1:54 am

I read that post, just like I read Miracle's posts! :x
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Re: RELIGION THREAD

Postby RideTheLightning » Mon Jan 26, 2009 2:00 am

...Well you guys are the only two!

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