The South Park Criticism Thread.

Talk about anything South Park

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Nintendorkus
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Postby Nintendorkus » Fri Jun 30, 2006 7:59 pm

What? Smug Alert was great! They just show it too damn much.

And I don't think a whole episode on car jokes would've been very good anyway.
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Kyle the Skeptic
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Postby Kyle the Skeptic » Fri Jun 30, 2006 9:22 pm

Aren't you contradicting yourself then?

Also I didn't say I didn't like the episode, I said that the main gag was too shallow and they didn't take full advantage of the opportunity to make it funnier.
Nintendorkus
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Postby Nintendorkus » Fri Jun 30, 2006 9:28 pm

I mean a whole episode based on different car jokes, they need to stick with a more original topic, such as people being smug when they own a hybrid, as opposed to something as vague as just random car jokes.
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UnkieHerb
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Postby UnkieHerb » Mon Jul 03, 2006 4:41 pm

My main South Park-related gripe is the way the show sometimes focuses on secondary characters for no real reason. I could stand it in seasons 1-6, when these episodes were rare and the characters were usually interesting ones.

Now, however, it seems each season we have to sit through 20 minutes of either Timmy's indecipherable "Timeeeh!"-ings, Butters' dreadfully unfunny naive child act (Which is odd because in seasons 3-5 he's sometimes more vulgar than Kenny), Jimmy(Which explains itself), or another even less important character such as Randy Marsh or Towelie.

It...sickens me.
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Oneirogenic
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Postby Oneirogenic » Tue Jul 04, 2006 12:26 am

Kyle the Skeptic wrote:It's been said before but I don't mind if they include a political message in the show, so long as it doesn't detract from the comedic elements. I have definitely noticed that in many of their highly political episodes they missed out on a lot (and I mean a LOT) of opportunities, not just to be funny but to derive additional material from the particular issue they were framing.

For a recent example take "Smug Alert". Yeah I get it already, some people who drive hybrid cars have an attitude about it. The problem is that this isn't an observation with universal application, and as far as vehicles that cause attitude problems it's really a small nitpick. What about people with self-esteem problems who compensate by driving expensive cars? What about men with inferiority complex issues (you know what I mean) who drive large SUVs? Then of course you've got Road Rage and all those people who regard their cars as weapons of mass destruction. What they did instead though was take a single joke, that wasn't all that funny to begin with, and beat it to death.


See, I saw it as VERY relevant to society and everything in general. People love to take ANYTHING that makes them better than others and rub it in others faces in a totally smug way. It's worse than saying, "I am better than you, damnit." and replacing it with a twofaced satisfaction. XD but then again, I'm in a few internet communities where this sort of thing runs rampant.


On topic, though...hmm. I dunno if I have too many gripes about the series as much as a few episodes. I wasn't very fond of Bloody Mary or AMLF, but I lolled enough to not be totally annoyed by the episodes.

I am kinda peeved that they've taken to ignoring Kenny and Tweek, replacing him with Butters, but I guess it works, because he's Kenny's completely inflexible as a character, and [maybe?] it gets hard to remember to make Tweek flinch as much?

Eh. I like the politics and morals. They've always been there, they're just less subtle now. *shrug* It just doesn't bother me. They've been a weebit more preachy, but they do pop up with more "classic" [whatever that means] episodes to temper the politics with. Or, at least more classic moments within the episodes with social commentary.
Tweeks_Coffee
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Postby Tweeks_Coffee » Tue Jul 04, 2006 3:52 pm

SouthParkLibertarian wrote:I dont understand how someone can enjoy the show without enjoying the political/social commentary. Beginning with Cartman's Silly Hate Crime (Ep 401) and continuing through Season 10, at least half or more of the episodes have involved politics.

Honestly, the best era of south park ran from Season 6 to halfway through Season 9.

Ive been watching South Park from day one, and while those early immature episodes were entertaining, I'm glad that Trey and Matt have moved on and used South Park for more intelligent comedy while still doing the kickbacks to the immature childish humor as well.


I hate it when people say that the show's intelligent now. Listen, putting your political views into a show doesn't make it intelligent. What exactly is intelligent about people smelling their own farts, talking private parts and blood spraying onto the Pope's face? It's more immature now than it ever was, and frankly the writing has gotten rather lazy.

And on the topic of overdoing jokes, Trapped In The Closet was bad. The only joke in that episode was the coming out of the closet bit. Then they opted to do that joke for 2 minutes, rather than put forth an ounce of work and write some more jokes.
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UnkieHerb
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Postby UnkieHerb » Thu Jul 06, 2006 6:42 am

Tweeks_Coffee wrote:
I hate it when people say that the show's intelligent now. Listen, putting your political views into a show doesn't make it intelligent. What exactly is intelligent about people smelling their own farts, talking private parts and blood spraying onto the Pope's face? It's more immature now than it ever was, and frankly the writing has gotten rather lazy.

And on the topic of overdoing jokes, Trapped In The Closet was bad. The only joke in that episode was the coming out of the closet bit. Then they opted to do that joke for 2 minutes, rather than put forth an ounce of work and write some more jokes.



You win, sir, for pointing out how overused the coming out of the clost joke was in TiTC, but South Park more immature than ever? Dude, Cartman Gets An Anal Probe was probably the most immature episdoe of any non-Drawn Together animated comedy EVER.

And lazy writing? What wasn't lazy about 20 minutes of fart/ass jokes and swear words?
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iceiwynd
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Postby iceiwynd » Thu Jul 06, 2006 6:55 am

See, the difference is that Anal Probe actually had a bit more of a story (stories, even? Cartman/Kyle/Ike/Visitors and Stan/Wendy) to it, and didn't rely on merely one joke for half an episode.
UnkieHerb
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Postby UnkieHerb » Thu Jul 06, 2006 3:35 pm

iceiwynd wrote:See, the difference is that Anal Probe actually had a bit more of a story (stories, even? Cartman/Kyle/Ike/Visitors and Stan/Wendy) to it, and didn't rely on merely one joke for half an episode.


Don't get me wrong, I'm no big fan of TiTC, but look at, say, Kenny Dies. Was that immature? No. It took an old joke and turned it upside down (Kenny's death actually matters, for once), but didn't dwell on it for the whole episode. It had Cartman trying to sell fetuses, Stan not being able to cope with Kenny's death, and, of course, Kenny himself. And not one immature fart joke in the lot.

Compare THAT to Anal Probe's "jokes" (farting fire? How funny for the 12-year olds) and say South Park has become more immature.
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MissingOctober
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Postby MissingOctober » Thu Jul 06, 2006 5:18 pm

UnkieHerb wrote:Compare THAT to Anal Probe's "jokes" (farting fire? How funny for the 12-year olds) and say South Park has become more immature.


Yeah, they were beginning. They were just starting out, searching for their calling and they didn't know what would work. Later on, after Anal Probe, they built something. They built a pattern. Then, I'd say, toward their later seasonss, they lost that pattern. They felt the need to go to current events more important than giving us something with the characters we already know. Do I care about Al Gore? No. Would I like to hear a joke ripping on him? Sure. Just... Just put it in for a couple seconds, as they used to do in the old days. The movie "Contact," Patrick Duffy, Eric Roberts. All one second or couple of minutes jokes. They were never the whole freaking show.

Tweeks_Coffee wrote:I hate it when people say that the show's intelligent now. Listen, putting your political views into a show doesn't make it intelligent. What exactly is intelligent about people smelling their own farts, talking private parts and blood spraying onto the Pope's face? It's more immature now than it ever was, and frankly the writing has gotten rather lazy.


I agree, Tweeks. Only an immature 12-year-old would act that childish and press their beliefs into a show. It's not like I don't love the political stuff, but- Seriously- it's getting repetitive. Butt Out isn't exactly, but is closely similiar, to My Future Self n' Me. The message is exactly the same! Child Abduction is like Wacky Molestation Adventure, which is in a way like Chef Returns. I've got it! Touching children is bad... Oh, yeah. Then there's NAMBLA.

About the lazy thing, I remember hearing in a bunch of commentaries that they wanted to stop the whole A and B way of writing the show. Nice... We get to hear about how much lazy they want to become. They want to do less work... How rich. Plus, they didn't even say they wanted to do that b/c they thought the show would be better. It basically sounded like they wanted to be more lazy. They act like they love Cartmanland so much, b/c they were beginning to change their way of writing the show, as opposed to their older and finer works. I don't give a f*ck about Cartmanland! I liked the A and B. If it takes more work, then that's it! That's their job. Get off their asses and get to writing and give us something! Change it up, if they want, but don't find excuses not to make a good show. I frankly don't care about how they're putting too much into the show. A little effort makes something worth watching.

I love the shows now, yeah, but there was something about it then.
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iceiwynd
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Postby iceiwynd » Thu Jul 06, 2006 5:34 pm

Honestly, I don't care about how immature something is. I like immaturity, when appropriate. Say the word "penis" and I'll giggle.

On the A and B story thing: I like both. I think it's pretty sweet that they're able to come up with one story that can fill in a twenty-one-ish minutes, and two stories being able to do that does seem like a bit of a weaker story to me, but hey, they're also pretty cool. Although they haven't really totally ditched the A story B story formula, even if the two stories are still pretty similar. Manbearpig tied together the whole Al Gore thing and the trapped in a cave/treasure thing, and I'd still consider that A and B story, because Cartman eating treasure had NOTHING to do with Manbearpig. In Marjorine, the story branched off with Butters and his parents and then the rest of the boys trying to get the paper fortune teller. And even The Passion of the Jew had, like, A, B, and C stories: Kyle had a story, Cartman had a story, and Stan and Kenny had a story.

I don't want them all A stories and I don't want them all A and B stories, and for me, I feel that they've got a nice balance. Most of my favourite episodes are A stories. I wouldn't call it "lazy writing" just because there's only one story to an episode, I'd only call it lazy writing if the writing failed to hold itself up and let down in an incredibly weak manner. If you can take one story and keep it going strong throughout twenty-one minutes, then all the better, I say.

I do agree about the celebrity jokes, though. I'm really not all that into pop culture at all. I know some of the biggies but that's about it. I don't care about these celebrities, most of the time I have no idea who the f*ck they are, so just make your little crack and get on with it.
Rualya
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Postby Rualya » Thu Jul 06, 2006 9:12 pm

Kenny doesn't do anything anymore! I want to see Kenny do something besides die!
WyldeJ
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Postby WyldeJ » Thu Jul 06, 2006 9:21 pm

"Doesn't do anything anymore"

He's never really done anything.. =)

And he hasn't died recently, unless i'm having short term memory loss...

Also the only thing is could critisise (< that's splet so wrong..?!) SouthPark for is Episode 1005.....

(* Turn's on TV, switches to Oprah, stab's Oprah's vagina with a katana*)
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It's Official.
Rualya
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Postby Rualya » Sat Jul 08, 2006 12:11 am

Jay C wrote:Thank you. I think Jimmy is an overrated character, but nowhere near as overrated as Timmy. I´ve never liked Timmy, and never will. Why? Because South Park is a comedy, and hearing someone say 'TIMMAH!' isn´t funny. It isn´t comedy.

Why do people like Timmy? And don´t give me that lazy assed answer that 'Oh, he's supposed to be random!' because it doesn't work. Random is good, but at the same time, at least make it funny and original. Any dickhead could have thought up a character who could only say his name and one random phrase.

I agree with you!
Kyle's_Marklar wrote:
The same can be said about Kenny. Why does everyone like Kenny? You can't even understand what he says! Am I the only one who feels this way? Do you all understand whatever it is that he mumbles? I understand when he says little things like "yea" but that doesn't really tell me much about his personality...

Everyone likes Kenny because you can't understand most of the things he says. However, you are right about the fact that we don't know much about his personality. Maybe if Matt and Trey gave him more lines we could know more about Kenny!
randyguyngal4
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Postby randyguyngal4 » Sat Jul 08, 2006 3:43 pm

As a long time fan of South Park, I've got to say that South Park is still one of the funniest shows on television. Does it have bad episodes? Why certainly! There's no show that can maintain such a high level of quality for every single episode.

Is the show not as good as it "used to be"? Frankly, I think it is. Yes, some of the shows are political these days. Some of the shows are retribution against those who've wronged Trey and Matt. Some of the shows are simply farcical to the extreme, but they're (for the overwhelming part) extremely entertaining and funny!

I'm amazed by the folks here who are criticizing because CHARACTER_NAME is getting so much attention. Or because CHARACTER_NAME isn't funny. To me, South Park has evolved into an ensemble show to the point that episodes like "Marjorine" or "Butters" can be done. Yes, sometimes they fail ("Towlie"), but overall, these episodes are the ones that are hysterical to me.

Lastly, any show's fans will become jaded over time and some will drift away either through attrition (not caring anymore) or because the show has gone in a direction they don't care for. If it comes to that for me, then I'll leave the viewership. I did it for LOST, and I did it for ENTERPRISE. Will South Park join that list? Not as far as I'm concerned now. But if you're not happy with the show any more, then it might be time to watch something else...

As I said earlier, SP is one of the funniest and most entertaining shows on TV, and I think it's going to stay that way for some time to come.

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