The Official Cartman Discussion Thread

Discuss South Park characters with all your friends, buddies and guys.

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CartmansCuzzin
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Postby CartmansCuzzin » Mon Jan 08, 2007 8:52 am

Aim I don't want you to agree with me because I respect all of your opinions. You and I are actually the only people that seem to post daily nowadays so I thank you for keeping me company on this site, honestly. However, I loved the original seasons too but I'm all about changes. I want characters to grow as time go by and it just so happens that Cartman seems more adult minded at times than the rest of the kids (well except when he's acting like a brat).

Okay, the "2nd half" of season 10 wasn't the greatest but it was the intangables (spell check that for me) that made it funny. Eric is naturally hilarious and he really doesn't have to say or do much to make us puke out our guts or make milk squirt out our noses. Like on the "Go God Go XII" when Kyle told him to suck his balls and Cartman replied with "yes Kyle, I will suck your balls. I will suck em' dry, Kyle!" (LAUGHING) I cryed all night! I thought that was the funniest response from Eric in awhile. I felt that whole series was one of his best work yet. It's the little things about him that makes him the favorite character on the show, not the growth of his personality but I can understand Aim...you're just a bigger fan of the earlier stages of SP and it's nothing wrong with that at all.

M&T may have made the children of SP much more mature than what they were in seasons 1-5 but along as the humor is still around, the show will never die.
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Aimsireil
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Postby Aimsireil » Mon Jan 08, 2007 9:36 am

^Thank you very much for the compliments. You too, you post a whole lot.

I'm just saying that Cartman, not to mention the rest of the characters on South Park, have developed very predictible patterns. I'm also saying that Cartman has been hogging all the good roles lately... for instance, compare these roles:

Cartman travels to the future and fights in a Star-Wars like environment

Stan coaches a pee-wee hockey team

Kenny... wait, Kenny didn't do squat this season.

Kyle takes drugs

Now, it is, or should be obvious that Cartman has the most memorable role from the past season.


I just really liked the old Cartman, the one who broke into song randomly, who loved to play with his dolls, and who wasn't evil, but just mean and spoiled. "Cat Orgy" is my favorite Cartman episode, ever, because it portrayed him as a stupid, lovable 8-year old, instead of the disgustingly cruel Cartman we have today.
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iceiwynd
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Postby iceiwynd » Mon Jan 08, 2007 2:50 pm

Personally, I think you're doing quite a bit of over-glorifying of the older episodes here. Yes, it's true there's been a bit of an increase in more Cartman in the show lately. Oh no. People do the same thing with Stan episdoes because he tends to hog the screen for the whole half hour. And for some reason, nobody complained when Kyle started getting all of the big roles in season ten, right up until Go God Go.

Now see, I respect your opinions, etc., it just might not seem like it right now for the purpose of argument (because it's not a good discussion if people just keep saying "I respect your opinions" over and over and over). You're complaining about Cartman becoming predictable now. RIGHT. Like he wasn't predictable before? All that really changed was a bit of an increase in intelligence (and, as ALSO shown by the Go God Go episodes, he still is a stupid spoiled little brat), which, if anything, adds a bit of an increase to the inpredictablity.

However, I'm still trying to figure out when being a tad predictable instantly became EEEVIIIL. I've seen it being complained about The Simpsons numerous times; a show that's been on-air for 18 years now. The newer episodes are never as bad as people enjoy making them out to be, and it seems to be the case with the South Park fan group, too.

Frankly, I'm finding it very, very frustrating. Back from when I first joined this forum there were numerous topics of "SOUTH PARK SUCKS NOW!!" and I find it really disappointing that this attitude still stands up incredibly strongly. People like to over-glorify the older seasons a LOT, because I definitely don't find them as good as they're often made out to be, and, seems to me, a big part of it comes from the nostaglia feel about it. I get a bit of a nostalgia feel myself from watching the older episodes, despite not coming into the show in between runs in season nine, but that's not really a good enough reason to cut out the new episodes all together.

Cartman still breaks out into song randomly (Urinal Deuce). He still does play with his dolls something (Bebe's Boobs Destroy Society, season six, but on that note, Miss Teacher Bangs a Boy, he's basically just playing dressup the whole time like a regular little kid). He's increased a bit in diabolicy, but that's character evolution. Face it. The characters would get BORING AS HELL if they just did the same things all the time. You've mentioned it with Kenny all the time, and yet, when it comes to Cartman, it seems like you just wish he stayed exactly the same throughout all ten years. He's had a bit of character growth and change, for the better or for the worse, but he hasn't changed nearly as much as people relaly love to make it out.

Yeah. Sorry if I got pissy ehre. I'm just getting pretty goddamn fed up with people exaggerating this whole situation and constantly bashing on the newer episodes because it's not as "perfect" as the older days, which I find to be total bullsh*t.
CartmansCuzzin
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Postby CartmansCuzzin » Mon Jan 08, 2007 5:21 pm

^Sorry to get off topic but you mispelled the words "really" and "here". :-l

And another thing, when is it negative to respect another person's opinion on something you're both fans of? C'mon now, even ESPN sports commentators give credit to one another sometimes but hey, I guess you're just the conceited type.

Okay I'm not going to tpye back a news report like you did but from what I've read, I see you are a true SP fan and you understand the cause of character evolution. Using the Simpsons again for example, if the same concepts and expectations were constantly repeated or if there were NOTHING changed during the show's run then it would be (89'-93') chisled on their tombstones right about now.

SP is unique for it's ability to evolve characters & ideas on a regular basis , sorta like it was a reality sitcom. Also the creators must know when to take it to a certain extinct and not to overblow the show's identity which can cause confusion and boredom. Animated shows such as "Dragonball Z" & "Pokemon" are perfect examples for this subject. Yeah they blew up and were considered the highest rated cartoons in the past but comparing their past to present time...yea my point exactly. Basically TOO MUCH icing on a small ass piece of cake. What makes SP so successful is their ability to come up with incredible and unbelievable concepts BUT also to make us fans eager to know what's next. Giving us appetizers and seeing the food on the table BUT not exactly eating it. Get it?
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iceiwynd
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Postby iceiwynd » Tue Jan 09, 2007 12:46 am

CartmansCuzzin wrote:^Sorry to get off topic but you mispelled the words "really" and "here". :-l

And another thing, when is it negative to respect another person's opinion on something you're both fans of? C'mon now, even ESPN sports commentators give credit to one another sometimes but hey, I guess you're just the conceited type.


- Irrelevant. I type rather quickly and can't be bothered to read over my posts and catch all of the typos. You made some, too, but since it's obvious that you know what you're talking about and that they're nothing more than typos I'm not gonna chew you out for them. See how it works?

- I never said it was negative to respect another person's opinion. I said it was negative to have to state it constantly just so the other person doesn't get whiny, throw their hands up in the air, and start proclaiming things like "FINE, THEN WOULD YOU RATHER I JUST LEAVE?!" (Not a personal jab at you, Aim, it's just the frequent response so many people use.)

In addition to the "make us fans so eager as to what's coming up next", not just that. The fact that they can grow, change, and not be stuck in a rut the whole time. And don't tell me that there hasn't been any change in Cartman, or anyone/anything else at all since their most drastic one. Characters have a set basic character, that's why other people can easily interpret it and write it for themselves (re, fanfiction), but they're constantly growing and changing. The best way to see it is in subtle changes, though. Scott Tenorman Must Die was a big leap, but sometimes those are required, too.

Tsst is a good Cartman episode. It shows him as both a stupid, spoiled little kid, and as a bit of an evil mastermind - but not so much since his plan to kill his mom was hardly well-put together and was basically just a simple-means solution. without considering the after-effects. That's his character. He's spoiled, and rotten, and everyone hates him, but he's willing to take the further step, even if it's not the smartest one. That's where his character crosses more into surrealism.
Aimsireil
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Postby Aimsireil » Tue Jan 09, 2007 12:48 am

Alright, get ready for a long post...

I am, for the last time, not talking about how long characters are onscreen. I am talking about how outrageous and memorable their roles are. And you know what? Cartman get all of those roles. Kyle, while he gets a lot of screentime, usually just plays the opposition to Cartman. Stan also gets a lot of screentime, however he usually never does anything overly memorable.

I was probably wrong about Cartman being any more predictable than he always was, however I still stand by his having no soul :). And I wasn't saying that his predictability was what was making him evil, I was talking about how he dresses up as Hitler and commits mass murder and such. (I'm referencing to "Die, Hippie, Die", in case you don't remember.) And some of the newer episodes are as bad as people enjoy making them out to be. And some of the newer Simpsons episodes are dumb, also. I could discuss this more specifically if you named an episode.

South Park doesn't "suck", it's just worse than it used to be. I liked the older seasons because of their original, creative ideas, while Season 10 basically just played off of current events, which took up about 8 or 9 episodes. SP used to have totally random things go on in it, like everybody turning to zombies, or evil animals from a parallel dimension attacking, or whatever it was. And SP used to have funny, bogus animals and other creatures in it, such as Mecha-Streisand, the mutant turkeys, Sexual Harassment Panda (he's a real panda! lol), Spookyfish, and Lemmiwinks.. The closest to that in season 10 were in "ManBearPig", where, of course, we saw the picture of ManBearPig, however ManBearPig didn't actually do anything, and the manatees in "Cartoon Wars", however after the initial shock these weren't as funny either.

And did you notice that this season only 1 episode ("Tsst") actually took place in the town of South Park for the entire episode? Every other episode involved the characters going somewhere. Now, I'm not saying that's so bad, however I am saying that it appears the show is sucked dry for ideas.

Sorry, I went off ranting... anyways, in "Mystery of the Urinal Deuce", Cartman did break out into song, however it was not random like it used to be; it was a song related to the topic. I was referring to episodes like "I'm a Little Bit Country" and "Kenny Dies". And "Bebe's Boobs Destroy Society" was from over four years ago. If you compare Cartman's dressing up as The Dog with playing "dress-up", you are comparing anybody who wears nose rings or braids their hair as playing dress-up. The only part of it that was really dress-up was the fake beard, the rest was just dressing up. Boy, was that confusing.

And I don't think he should have stayed exactly the same. I'm basically just saying that he isn't the same at all as he used to be, minus occasionally. And he has changed, a whole lot. As much as I love to make it out.

And Cuzzin, what do you mean... oh, you mean "take it to a certain extent". Sorry, that really threw me off. Anyhow, I didn't mean to come off like I would have wanted the show to stay the same forever, rather I just think that it evolved and became different in a bad way, even going so far as to ignore its own setup.

And while I'm not saying SP is as small a piece of cake as the other shows you mentioned, I still think it is basically too much icing, like the cake itself has already been eaten out from under the frosting. Get it?
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NauaCaos
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Postby NauaCaos » Tue Jan 09, 2007 12:59 am

Aimsireil wrote:And did you notice that this season only 1 episode ("Tsst") actually took place in the town of South Park for the entire episode? Every other episode involved the characters going somewhere.
How about "Make Love, Not Warcraft" and "Miss Teacher Bangs a Boy"?
iceiwynd
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Postby iceiwynd » Tue Jan 09, 2007 1:02 am

Well, that's cleared up a bit. :B

I think it's more like this: SP has moved from abstract to surreal. In the earlier seasons, yeah, there were definitely things completely off-center that would just throw you off. Lately, it's been seeming much more realistic, but then you have to remember the fact that SP doesn't do things the way other shows would, and so, it's a bit more surreal. So it stays a bit closer to home, but it has children doing all of these things that would never happen, with a few bits of random crap that really make no sense whatsoever. Except now they've been more and more integrated into being real, especially in South Park's world.

I think a lot of it has to do with time. As time goes on, you're going to start running out of ideas, but it's already awesome that they've made it a decade and they're going to keep on going. I think that's also where another bit of it plays in, in that things that once seemed totally f*cked up just don't anymore, even if they are on the same level as they were in the past - because that's what you've come to expect now.
CartmansCuzzin
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Postby CartmansCuzzin » Tue Jan 09, 2007 1:47 am

Response to NC-(You're Correct).

Okay the surreal transformation is the reason why I'm still a huge SP fan but I must go off topic just a lil' bit. WAS SEASON 10 REALLY "THAT BAD" TO Y'ALL?! Wasn't the best season yes I understand but it damn sure wasn't the worst.

Besides "Stanley's Cup" and maybe some snippets of "Mystery Of The Urinal Douche". the rest of the 12 season ten eps were VERY original & enjoyable to me. Are y'all disappointed because Cartman received most of the attention this time around or what?

If that's the case then well newsflash folks...HE HAS ALWAYS RECEIVED THE MOST ATTENTION!
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Aimsireil
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Postby Aimsireil » Tue Jan 09, 2007 2:03 am

One second...

^^"Make Love, Not Warcraft" had scenes in Blizzard HQ, which, when I last checked, is nowhere near South Park.

"Miss Teacher Bangs a Boy" had scenes in the hotel during the end of the episode, which is most likely outside of South Park. However, this could probably go either way (most likely my way, though).


^You're right about it seeming realistic, but sometimes realism is pretty bad. For example, the end of "Stanley's Cup", while intended to be ironic, just made me want to puke. Killing off a cancer patient is no way to end a season... why couldn't they have had Stan's team win, and then have the stereotypical celebration? The episode was pretty funny with how it linked every sports film together, but why did it have to end? Now, don't get me wrong, reality is good for keeping everyone from going insane in Disney's happily-ever-after version of the world, but you don't have to completely contradict that to prove a point.

Realism is also what got rid of some other great parts of the show... such as scenes where Mr. Hat would almost behave like a real person, or where Kenny would die, or where Kenny would mumble, or where Stan would puke, or where Kyle would kick his baby brother, or where Canadians would look like cartoon characters, or where Jesus would help the boys. None of those things are actually realistic, which is probably why they were taken out of the show; as puppets aren't alive, people can't resurrect, coats don't muffle your words, guys don't actually puke (some might, but I don't know them) when they see a girl they like, babies cannot be realistically kicked like footballs, people do not look like cartoon characters*, and Jesus does not live in America. Realism is probably also the reason that ManBearPig did not appear in solid form, as I was hoping, or that... oh, wait I forgot about the otters in my last post. Sorry, the otters were hilarious animals this season... or were they that funny at all? They seemed a lot like humans. Anyhow, realism is probably why "Park County" is coming into existence, why Officer Barbrady was eliminated, etc etc. Not saying it's all bad, I'm just saying that total realism has no place on a show like SP.

*In "Christmas in Canada", the Canadians, while they had the traditional heads and rectangual bodies, they were much more realistic; for example the mime had fingers, and the Canadians had colorful outfits, etc. Also the scenery was incredibly realistic, and not at all like it was in the movie or in "Not Without My Anus". After that episode, Canadians were actually left out of the show until the brief T&P scene in "Cartoon Wars: Part II", but that was only a parody of "Not Without My Anus." So as you can see, the unrealistic Canadians have mostly been left out of the show for years.
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Infusions
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Postby Infusions » Mon Jan 22, 2007 2:24 am

^ I think you missed the entire point to the ending of Stanley's Cup... o_O It's funny how people hate the whole 'cancer patient dying' idea, but didn't complain or give a rat's ass about some woodland critters sacrificing a rabbit to the devil, then eating it's guts and having a blood orgy afterwards.

Or when the credits showed "Willxyz" dead on the moon for the entire credit sequence. Or even when Butters pretended to kill himself and the hysterical screams and depression his parents had in two scenes. Or seeing a kindergarden teacher committ suicide. You people are weird. :D

Anyway. It's still really unbelievable to me how many people adore the old seasons so much. I don't care for what reason, whether it be original plotlines, characters' personalities, etc. Most of the jokes were horrible. Seriously, there were like, three to four things I laughed at total in Cow Days compared to the episode Tsst where I laughed at almost the entire thing.

And you guys are really misunderstanding things about the whole "realistic" thing in South Park. Yes, sure, they taking on real events, but they're doing [almost] exactly what they did in the past. And that's mocking and parodying those events. Before, the SP crew used to parody movies in their plotlines ((Don't tell me Mecha Streisand was 100% original. Everybody knows that's a straight parody of Godzilla, and possibly some other movies too)) but now, they parody current-events in their plotlines.

And the whole "They don't stay in South Park as much". The show isn't about staying in a town called South Park. It's mainly about the residents and characters in South Park and all the weird-ass events that started there. Yes, sure, they go off into different areas, but it all first started or took place in South Park. And I quote:

"We're lucky. Most people have a show about some kid, or a family. We have an entire town."

So it's not about the town place, it's about the town residents.

Oh, and you ((Referring to Aim)) keep saying how other characters' roles aren't as memorable as Cartman's now-a-days. Are you telling me Kyle getting blamed for 9/11 and trying to find out the truth isn't at all memorable? o_O

And Cartman doesn't get /all/ the attention. But considering that the crew only have a week to produce an episode, Cartman is almost the easiest character, and possibly most fun, to write for. The other characters get their own seasons at times too.

Season 8 = Stan
Season 9 = All Four
Season 10 = Kyle + Cartman

So yeah, Cartman doesn't really hog up most of the attention. It really all varies on what season you're watching.

With the exception of Hell on Earth 2006 and A Million Little Fibers, I loved all the episodes in season 10. You have no idea how excited I was to see part two of Go God, Go. Damn. I knew what Cartman meant by the whole "time slowing down" thing.
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Sereth1217
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Postby Sereth1217 » Wed Jan 31, 2007 4:54 am

I have to say, I think the newer seasons are for the most part, a little better. Because in the old seasons, Kyle, Stan (and sometimes Kenny) were always picking on Cartman. Now that Cartman is the smartest character in the show, he's gotten them all back for the jerkoffs they were in the old seasons. I think it's great. I think, as a whole, Cartman is much better in the newer seasons because he's smarter, funnier, more worldly, more evil; and at the same time ignorant, misinformed, and bratty as he was in the older episodes. It's like the perfect combo. He's smart, but at the same time his ignorance is always present, which usually causes his downfall.

Though I will admit I agree with him, hippies are the most worthless people on the planet.
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Aimsireil
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Postby Aimsireil » Sun Feb 11, 2007 10:52 pm

^^ I don't understand how you are comparing the death of a rabbit to the death of a little 3-year-old boy. There's a big difference there.
And I didn't miss the point to anything.

Willzyx was just a whale. People don't really relate to whales that much. And while I can't say that I enjoyed when Butters faked his death, nothing actually happened to him. He was fine later. The lady that his parents killed to feed him was just a random background character.

People wanted to see Ms. Stephenson dead. She was raping Ike the whole episode, and she wouldn't even take responsibility for her actions, blaming everything on alchohol. She got what was coming to her.

The old seasons had brilliant jokes. I am, of course, referring to how Satan and Saddam Hussein had a homosexual relationship, everything Mr. Hat did, how nobody took the Devil's coming seriously, how Jesus hosted a talk show, how Vietnam was "fun", how Mrs. Broflovski didn't even care that Barbara Streisand was a huge mutant, and asked for her autograph, how Chef would sing really dirty songs, how Canadians were cartoon characters, how Cartman would deny everything from his being fat to a satellite sticking out of his butt, how Cartman would play with his dolls, etc.

Cow Days was also brilliant. Jimbo was devastated after all the cows committed suicide, and yet he immediately wanted a "beer and a burger". Cartman thought he was a Vietnamese prostitute, but the rest of the boys didn't even really care about this. The announcer commented on how Cartman would have had much practice riding a bull. People died in the running of the cows. I could point out many more things, if you'd like.

You said we were misunderstanding the whole "realistic" thing in South Park, but you didn't give any reasons as to why.

And they still parody movie plotlines. Did you not see the beginning of "Tsst"? Or the road chase scene in "Cartoon Wars"? Or all of Stanley's Cup?

A town of people would usually imply the people in the actual town.


Now I am getting annoyed... stop ignoring everything that I say! Cartman had at least 5 or 6 roles in Season 10 that were as or more memorable as Kyle's role in "Urinal Deuce".


I don't have time to respond about your whole list of who starred in what season. But I will later.
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Infusions
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Postby Infusions » Mon Feb 12, 2007 1:42 am

1. I was really referring to how drastically the animals devoured the rabbit over a kid just dying right then and there without pain (Physical. Mentally is different). I dunno, a lot of people die in South Park whether they be evil or just a background character. But people don't seem to get upset until it's something like a cancer patient.

Wait. What about Jesus' death? D: Or is that a totally different story? I dunno...

2. Yeah, the old episodes had funny jokes, but maybe to me it was the voice acting that really makes things funny for it. Like how Cartman says, "Well, Blanket, I'm Howdy-Doowdy, and these are my friends, Timpsy, Winky, and Nod." from 'The Jeffersons' was funny because of the sarcasm put into it.

I dunno... I just wasn't big on the VA work from the old episodes. But now, they seem to really have all the characters down and such, so it's good to me. *Shrug*

3. I really forgot about the small little movie jokes they had in the episodes 'Tsst' and 'Cartoon Wars'. I was really referring to 'The Mystery of the Urinal Deuce' and 'ManBearPig' for the political parodies. My mistake. :0

4. I still say Season 10 was a Kyle+Cartman season, but I looked at all the episodes and see what you meant by most memorable. People would talk more about how Cartman was dressed as the Bounty Hunter Hall Monitor over Kyle trying to stop Ike from dating his teacher.

....

I like Cartman. I loved season 10. ;__; GAH, YOU PEOPLE. SEASON 10 WAS A DREAM COME TRUE FOR ME.

HOORAY FOR CARTMAN.

Now I'll shut up. :0
What's the difference between a 7-11 and a smurf?

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Aimsireil
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Postby Aimsireil » Mon Feb 12, 2007 9:49 am

^1

1. Cancer is actually quite painful, involving persistent cancer pain that can last up to 12 hours. This is usually treated with medication, however occasionally there is breakthrough cancer pain which no known medicine can numb.

If you were referring to his actual moment of passing, well, that's not painless for anybody. I think.

Usually people care more when a well-developed character dies than when a background character is killed. Would you care more if some random person died, or if your best friend got hit by a car? Same thing applies to a TV show (except not as important). Of course, I'm not saying that the lives of fake TV characters are more important than those of real people,(they're not) but you get what I mean.

It's sort of like, when the bad guy died in "Indiana Jones: The Lost Ark" people were all like "Well, bitch, you got what was coming to you", but if Indi himself had died, everybody would have been pissed.

Jesus... um... well, he died valiantly. He brought joy to the Middle East. Good for him.


2. That line was great. I wish that there were more jokes like that.


Out of time to finish posting.
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